Automotive Future…..
Does anyone think that the automotive manufacturers are going to offer any viable alternatives to the dinosaur-powered models on the market now?….. I don’t see anything that would make any major impact coming out in the near future….. I’m still seeing ads for big V-8’s and large SUV’s from all the manufacturers….. Granted, I’m a ex-muscle car owner and love the feel of lots of power, but I think with the price and availability of petroleum products, I’m willing to give it up for a cheaper, cleaner, and readily available alternative….. I just don’t think big business and our government is ready to end our dependence on fossil fuels….. There’s still billions out there to be made off of the general public….. I understand that cost is going to be a problem because today’s cars are a major investment for most people and getting rid of a car that is running perfectly just to get one the operates cheaper would be out of most people’s financial ability, but the manufacturers would clean-up after the initial cost of development and production costs….. I just don’t think they are ready to make that step yet…..
So-o-o, what are we going to do and when?….. Just wait until there’s no more fuel?….. Go to war (more than we already are) for the last fuel reserves?….. you tell me – if you can……
May 12th, 2006 at 3:16 pm
60 Minutes & Dateline both ran segments on the Flex alternative, which utilizes ethanol made from almost anything. What are the chances that our government would allow this to happen?
May 12th, 2006 at 4:49 pm
Yeah, ethanol has been around since before the first gas crunch in the late ’70’s – early ’80’s….. The government – big business has just not made it profitable for the farmer to make more money from his corn crops for ethanol production than he makes selling it for popcorn…. 9 below zero – That’s the chances for government backing in the foreseeable future….
May 12th, 2006 at 4:55 pm
I’ve heard some conflicting reports about ethanol taking more energy to produce than it actually provides itself. That doesn’t sound too helpful, but I don’t know if it’s true.
The car companies (well, at least the foreign ones) seem to be embracing hybrid techology, which I think is a good start. And despite those power-hungry driver’s complaints, I’ve read some things about hybrids actually accelerating faster than their non-hybridized counterparts.
I think hydrogen is promising, too, but we need a serious research effort focused on it. Imagine if the US invested the type of resources and manpower like the New Deal or the Manhatten Project… and it’s cheaper than war for oil! People used to worry about hydrogen explosions, but I think this fear is misplaced. Hydrogen is a gas, it will dissipate quickly in the event of a leak, and in the event of an explosion, it all goes up! Gasoline explodes and scatters flaming liquid around everywhere. Much messier.
May 13th, 2006 at 2:04 am
There is an interesting article in the May issue of Road & Track. They do a road test comparing the Toyota Camry SE V-6 , the Ford Escape V-6 and the Honda Civic EX with the hybrid counterpart of each vehicle. At $2.62 a gallon ( the average price at the time of the test ), you would have to drive the Camry hybrid 101,195 miles, the Escape hybrid 93,679 miles and the Civic hybrid 180,000 miles to recover the price difference between the hybrids and their siblings. The Civic EX is already quite fuel efficient, so the Civic hybrid is only 24% more so. Of course we all know that fuel prices are going to go A LOT higher during the life of these 2007 vehicles, and that would bring those mileage-for-payback figures down accordingly.
May 13th, 2006 at 9:54 am
I wonder if the ethanol requiring too much energy to be feasible isn’t oil producers furnishing us with mis-information?…. Of course, start-up expenses would be huge…. You need growers, refineries, a distribution network, retailers, and vehicles that would run on more than the 10% or so they are now using for an additive…. All of these would have to be in total sync with one another…. A major project with many different business mind sets working together…. Hard, very, very, hard….
I agree the hybrid’s are a start, but I would like to see hydrogen explored more…. as TTop said,I think gas is more dangerous in a accident than batteries or hydrogen…
As another point, in Oklahoma at least, is speed limit enforcement…. If you drive the speed limit or below, which I do, you are literally run over…. I don’t know how much, if any, fuel savings occur by driving at slower speeds, but the government seemed to think they were some when they lowered the speed limits on interstates in the ’80’s…. Of course, it takes you longer to get to your destination, so I don’t know exactly what the offset is…..
May 13th, 2006 at 12:38 pm
My wife has a Prius and is very happy with it. Gets around 40 mpg. We had one problem with it that you may have read about. The wiring harness shorted out and screwed up its brain. Everything shut down….on the freeway. Toyota took care of it no hassle. No problems since. I am still waiting to see how it works out. One thing you have to consider is the battery. It is warrantied for 8 years or 80,000 miles and costs something like $5,000 to replace. Don’t quote me on price.
I don’t like the visibility out the back window. Seems like you give up some trunk space for the battery. You have to get used to differences in the operation of the unit, like no key and button functions. Has good acceleration. I saw a graph and comparison of the acceleration of an electric motor compared to gas engine. Gas engine gets the jump but the acceleration of the electric motor just keeps climbing like a rocket while the gas engine falls off. It’s a good car to drive. Ask jek what he thought.
May 15th, 2006 at 8:00 am
Yeah, I agree with the visibility issue on the Prius (a friend has one). They are too expensive right now, both because of the technology and the manafactuering is relatively new, but also they are a bit of a status symbol (at least in liberal Seattle) and demand is high. Once manufactuering ramps up the cost will come down, just by competition. Unfortunately I think the Prius (at least the hatchback) and the Honda Insight just look too goofy. Like someone’s idea of what a future car should look like. I think these will look very dated in five years, like the old aquarium car (what were those called?). I think Honda is getting the right idea by making an Accord hybrid. Why make owners who make good car choice drive something that looks like the designer watched too much Jetsons?
May 15th, 2006 at 11:32 am
And, they have a big butt.
May 15th, 2006 at 2:16 pm
I was very happy to see an Accord hybrid here in OK a few weeks back. I did a double-take, since I thought at the time that the only hybrid Honda models were the Insight (ugly) and the Civic (fine).
I like the idea of fuel cells (hydrogen), but safety aside, people don’t seem to realize there’s not a lot of free H_2 floating around. Energy is required in order to synthesize usable hydrogen, and where will that come from? fossil fuels? nuclear? solar? biological? ethanol? I’m not poo-pooing the possibility at all — what’s not to like about a combustion process whose only (chemical) byproduct is water? But it’s a tough problem.
The ideas of flex-fuel/ethanol/hybrids might be good things to tide us over. I’ve seen a couple articles that SUV makers are using the hybrid idea, but with an emphasis on performance instead of efficiency. Definitely the wrong way to go, IMO.
As a renewable fuel, ethanol makes sense in that it shouldn’t contribute to additional CO_2 in the atmosphere. Even if its production is somewhat inefficient as TTop mentions (something I’ve heard too, and have searched extensively on, but have never been able to find any numbers for), the fact that its production becomes part of the carbon cycle means that this really isn’t too bad of a problem. Of course, there are ecological concerns with pesticides, land use, etc., switching over to a corn “economy.”
May 17th, 2006 at 10:25 pm
Yeah, I’ve driven Anon’s wife’s Prius. I knew there’d be trouble when the little car graphic on the display had its wheels rotating while also letting us know that we were going 0 MPH (nowhere). I trust they fixed that little glitch too. I must say that I am strangely attracted to the ugly buggers, though what I’d really think about getting is a 4-door Mini Cooper, if one was offered.
HS is right about hydrogen. The big problem is that we would have to produce it, which you guessed it, takes energy. How much energy? Using current methods, more than we get out of it with the car itself. So still some work to do there.
May 27th, 2006 at 9:55 pm
Nothing is going to change until Big oil and Big Business (Including the Auto makers) get the hell out of Big govt. And let the free exchange of ideas happen, I’m sure that someone has worked out the problems mentioned but, ant not to be a conspiracy nut the persons who have made these discoveries have either been squelched by the Bigs or are afraid to come forward for fear of this happening.